Templates on other MIDI targets than 0

[akindo]

Hi. I'm having problems using some Lemur templates on any other "MIDI Targets" than 0.

First I need to understand something basic about these targets. Are they the same as a MIDI channel? So if I set the Lemur Daemon 3 to send controller data to my external MIDI interface, it will actually send it on MIDI channel 4 (because MIDI channels start at 1, whereas targets start at 0)?

The templates I've tried with are Live Control 2.1 and MicroWave. I've read that the Live Control template is set to use target 0. Is it possible to change this, and if so, where (I know Python as well)?

I'm suspecting that the MicroWave template is also configured to send on target 0. But it seems silly to make such a hardcoding. I believe it only sends Sysex data (it's to control an old Waldorf MicroWave hardware synthesizer which uses Sysex), which is MIDI channel independent, so I don't see why it doesn't work on other targets than 0. Where does one change the target inside a Lemur template?

The reason why I want to send on other targets than 0 is I want to have both the Live Control, MicroWave, and other templates set up to use different channels, so I don't have to change the setup in the Daemon/Lemur preferences everytime I change template.

Thanks for any help!

[mat]

Hey Akindo and welcome to the forum

The Midi targets are the Midiports - like virtual Midicables. On Mac (I guess) you have the IACports and Lemurports (right, Mac-users?), on PC you need 3rd Party software like Loopbe or Loopmidi or Midiyoke or...whatever. Each of these ports can send on any channel.
So if you want to change the channel, no need to change your port configuration. Channels are coded within the template - maybe in a variable or on each object...depends on how that template was build....

However,
you describe the situation of combining LiveControl2 with other templates. LiveControl uses complex Midimessages (different channels and CCs!) on target0. To avoid that LC accidently triggers something on the other template or Midi slows down because of high traffic, I would agree in using another Miditarget for additional templates. Therefore define your Miditargets in and out on target1 like you have done for target0, maybe using LoopMidi 3 and 4 instead of 1 and 2 on target0. (Always use different ports for in and out to avoid Midifeedback...like you would not put a real Midicable from in to out on same device). To change targets on template, set them in the mapping box in the editor (like also Midichannel). If the author of the template has used the parent concept right, you only need to change the target of the container on the highest hierarchical level and all other objects will follow. If parent was not used, you have to change all objects and variables manually.

Hope that helps
mat

[Phil999]

If the author of the template has used the parent concept right, you only need to change the target of the container on the highest hierarchical level and all other objects will follow. If parent was not used, you have to change all objects and variables manually.

another way is to open the jzml in a text editor and replace [wrong MIDI] with [desired MIDI], save under new name, and load that jzml into Lemur. Works for all 'normal' objects.

[akindo]

Thanks for the welcome and help, Mat and Phil!

By the way, I'm on a Mac.

Had a browse through the Lemur user guide (previously only read the section on setting up the Daemon). On page 46 it covers setting up MIDI in the templates. From what I understand, it says that you can chose between the 8 targets for your template. It does not talk about choosing a channel withing a target. But Mat, from your explanation it sounded like on each target there's 16 MIDI channels [on one MIDI cable you've also got 16 channels]).

The other question I have, you say to use MIDI targets 3 and 4, rather than 3 in both directions for my second template to avoid feedback. But in the Live Control setup guide, they say to setup the following in the Lemur Daemon:

MIDI Target 0 | From: Daemon Output 0 | To: Daemon Input 0

I think I'm still confused about the difference between targets and the Lemur Daemon input/output ports.

Anyways, in the next evenings I'll create two very simple test templates set to using different targets and try my way forward with different setups in the Daemon etc. to understand more.

[Macciza]

Hi
The Midi Targets (and the daemon) are basically virtual midi ports withs virtual cabling
There are 8 targets that can be set up - each one is a set of in and out cables with 16 channels each
So you might set up Targets 0 & 1 to be Daemon in/outs that you use in Live
You might also set up some targets that permanently address you hardware devices if they are connected to your computer
So you might have Midi 2 From: HardwareDevice To:Hardware device - then you set up projects to use that to control your device
If you are playing with a bunch of synths you could have extended control of all of them . . .
Hope that helps

[Phil999]

I think one question is not confirmed yet. So here it is: for one Lemur target, you mostly have to use two virtual ports of your computer. Usually it will look like this:

Lemur target 0 (MIDI0) --- input: virtual port 1 --- output: virtual port 2
Lemur target 1 (MIDI1) --- input: virtual port 3 --- output: virtual port 4
Lemur target 2 (MIDI2) --- input: virtual port 5 --- output: virtual port 6
...

This confused me as well in the beginning, because with real MIDI ports this is different. Even with some virtual MIDI ports, for example from the BCR2000, it is different. One only needs one port for in- and output, not two. However, that's how it is. Always use two virtual ports for one Lemur target.

[Macciza]

Hi Phil
It depends on OS - My answer refers to Mac which is what he is on, which has the subsystem needed to do it like I suggested . . .
and your answer refers to PC, which needs something like MidiYoke or LoopBe to do similar sort of stuff, with different rules, setup, performance etc . . .
Sorry about that will edit my post to be clear . ..

MM

[Phil999]

really? I do it like that on the Mac too.