Midi feedback with Logic 9

Hello,
I have been waiting for Lemur to come out on the iPad for a long time and am very excited about it.
One major question though is how do you get midi feedback working inside Logic Studio ?
With TouchOSC it required major environment hacking and I gave up as I didn't have the time to fiddle so much - so I ended up never using it.
Since the app is 50$ I want to be sure I can get it to work without too much hassle before taking the plunge.
Thanks in advance.

Hi FastTriggerFish,

Don't worry about OSC you should definitely use MIDI messages which Logic accepts, it is just a matter of setting up the preferences right inside Logic.

This video will explain you how to setup MIDI with Logic http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrBpzYq9HRs
I would recommend that you load the iPad - Studio Combo which comes with reconfigured MIDI messages.

Best regards,
Marino.

Yes, me too! I'd love to use this! Before I spend the money - WILL IT WORK IN LOGIC 8??? Thanks. I also use iRig midi connector from ipod - will that work also?

marino_liine wrote:Hi FastTriggerFish,

Don't worry about OSC you should definitely use MIDI messages which Logic accepts, it is just a matter of setting up the preferences right inside Logic.

This video will explain you how to setup MIDI with Logic http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrBpzYq9HRs
I would recommend that you load the iPad - Studio Combo which comes with reconfigured MIDI messages.

Best regards,
Marino.

Thanks a lot for your quick answer Marino, I will watch this video tonight.
Excuse me for my noob-ism, but what is a combo ? And would it only work for controlling e.g the logic mixer, or is it something that I could use together with other templates - so that if say I was using the FM8 template with the FM8 plugin inside logic I would get midi feedback to Lemur from changing the plugin parameters inside Logic ?

Hi 1dmac,

Lemur will work with any software that can receive MIDI or OSC. So to answer your question, yes it will work with Logic 8 and iRig.

Hope that helps.

Cheers,
M.

Studio Combo is just the name of the template - that's how we call it. It is a combination of templates to control your DAW (Logic, Ableton, etc...)
You can indeed control the Logic's mixer with it since it includes a section inside with only faders. If you have the MIDI Inputs and Outputs set correctly in Logic you will see whatever you do to FM8 reflected on the lemur template.

Cheers,
M.

marino_liine wrote:If you have the MIDI Inputs and Outputs set correctly in Logic you will see whatever you do to FM8 reflected on the lemur template.

Ok. I think "setup correctly" is kind of the problem here Getting plugins to respond to input as in the video is usually the easy part - the hard part is getting feedback to work.
The thing is, when you move a knob in a plugin inside logic, it sends as output a "fader" message with a number that corresponds to the internal mapping inside the plugin, which is not necessarily the same as the cc message number you mapped as input.
So for most midi controllers you end up having to spend a lot of time setting up environment objects that not only translate "fader" to midi cc, but also the correct midi cc number.
Or you do it the other way around by first moving all the knobs on the plugin, taking note of the fader number and/or channels, then make sure that the controller sends midi cc numbers that match.

Of course all this is a Logic problem rather than a Lemur issue, and I know a lot of other DAWs make this much easier, but I was wondering if there is an easier way with the Lemur app - like some existing environment objects you can drop into a project and maybe a bit of scripting on the Lemur to make the process be less work intensive.

Hi

I have a similar issue with Logic and MIDI feedback to Lemur.

Assuming I have Lemur using Daemon Input/Output 0 for routing MIDI data to and from Logic, how do I get it to respond to incoming MIDI data coming back from Logic? I can get MIDI info into Logic no problem (using ad hoc Wifi connection), but no matter what I do, I cannot get Lemur to see the MIDI data coming back out. I've tried routing the appropriate Environment objects in the Logic environment to Daemon Ouput 0, but still see no response in Lemur.

Thanks for any help.

Jules

Here is how you do it: (unless I misunderstand your quandary)
The monitor objects are optional.
** this implies you already have Lemur set up and are using a GUI you are happy with **

1 - In Logic, cmd+8 will open your Environment.
2 - At the MIDI Instr. page, go New -> Add Instrument and make its name "Lemur"
3 - Set the Port to the Lemur Daemon Output 0. (or whatever number I suppose you perfer)
4 - Click on the "Lemur" MIDI Object, hold down the option key and click to go to the "Mixer" page (up at the top left).
(this will take the Lemur MIDI Object to your channel strip page)
5 - Click New -> Transformer
6 - Route the output of your channel strip to the transformer.
7 - Route the output of the transformer to your Lemur MIDI Object. (See below for routing)
1.jpg
8 - Double click the transformer and set it to what I have set below:
You basically undo the mess that Logic makes, then send it out to Lemur.
a - You are taking the fader and converting it to a normal control
b - fader info is sent on the first plugin (channel 2) so you want to convert that back to the channel strip ( channel 1)
c - let the controller # and dd pass thru.
2.jpg

So ... maybe you help me now.
I want to be able to "Bang" (meta #99 in Logic) all current parameters of a soft synth back to my iPad Lemur.
I'm pulling my hair out getting Logic to bang it out.

Bammer - sorry, can't help you with your meta query, but your Logic feedback routing works great!

Thank you

Jules

Glad it's working Trailerman.
If we could figure out the Bang command, we might be able to put a button in Lemur to retrieve all the current parameter settings of the channel strip and soft synths so they would show in Lemur. (unless there is an easier way)

Now that would be cool!! Good luck!

Jules

I found a link that sort of describes how to do it. It's pretty deep environment stuff,

http://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=715

page 2 of that thread has some pretty good info. Might be over my head for now though. lol

You can't bang parameters of a plugin. But what you can do is have a bunch of faders connected from the output of a channel strip. Each fader would be programmed to respond to -- and mirror -- the value of specific parameters that you tweaked. You could then bang those faders and send the values back to the channel strip.

A more elegant (and complicated) way would be to use the mapset functions to set various map values within a transformer in response to the parameters you tweaked in a given plugin. You could then read out the map values at a later time and send them back to the channel strip.

So, in essence, each fader would kind of be a closed-loop system mutually exclusive unto itself. Each fader would feed/bang its respective plugin parameter back through the channel strip which, of course, would send the aggregate of all the fader bangs straight out to Lemur. Looks like a worthy weekend project.

And then here is an S.O.S article by Len Sasso explaining it in some detail --- near the bottom.
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun03/articles/logicnotes0603.asp

The Bang message (#99) is a particularly useful Meta message. When received by any Fader object (except one that's sending Meta messages, for reasons we won't go into here), it causes the object to resend its value. You might use that to send all values from a bank of Faders in a mixer or synth editor you've created. The Bang message value affects the outcome in various ways. If the value is an even number, the Bang message will be passed through the target object — useful when you want to Bang a whole chain of Faders. Values of 121 and 125 cause the Fader value to increment — with and without roll-over — before being sent (120 and 124 do the same with pass-through). Similarly, values of 123 and 127 cause the value to decrement.

I have just set up Bammer's Environment to get the feedback, and it works very well- thanks.

The only problem is that I now have a feedback loop of CC data that is crashing Logic.

Any ideas/strategies, anyone?

I am using:
Daemon Input 0 Receives from iPad Lemur Out 0
Daemon Output 0 Sends to iPad Lemur In 0
...in case that is what is doing it.Lemur Input.jpgLemur Feedback.jpg

Subject: Re: Midi feedback with Logic 9 help please

HOW CAN I DO IT? THERE IS NO WAY TO SELECT a MIDI INPUT as in other DAWs like cubase. I need your help for LogicX - this is unclear for me here.

I need setup for my Lemur App Composer Tool, I need to to create 2 tracks in Logic
one to send MIDI and one to receive midi
On the first track I need to set the output to Lemur
On the second track I need to send input to receive from Lemur and point it to virtual instrument

I need to recall presets from my Logic DAW from Lemur.
When I press Recall in my Lemur App - Lemur sends out CC127 at max value of 127
All I have to do is to send back to Lemur CC127 but values between 1-126 and by this Logic will recall corresponding preset

I need to be able to modify this what Logic receives - value 127 of CC#127 so Logic when receives such value sends back CC#127 value f.ex 53 on the first track
On my second track I I need to be able to modify this what Logic receives - value 127 of CC#127 so Logic when receives such value sends back CC#127 value f.ex 54


In Cubase I would need MIDI send and midi transformer to this

I need to create track and set its output to Lemur and then tell the transformer to convert CC127 value 127 to value 53. Now when I press Recall button in my LemurApp preset 53 is loaded

Please help how can I do it with ENVIROMENT

I am one step forward, BUT I am not sure how to do it using Transformer

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