Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select!

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

ok, so I have emailed support and waiting to see what they have to say before uploading anything to the library.

Cheers for all your comments.

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

So, I actually got sent a copy of your work from someone and am having a bit of a look into it all . . .
Initially it does not seem to be working; iMac i7, Mac OSX 10.8.3, Live 9.0.1 Trial (not upgraded from 8 Suite yet) Max 6.1(full license, full install) . . .
Will have to investigate further and see what you have done . . .
Cheers
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Are you using live x64? Mu doesnt work with live x64

Do you have the two ".js" files in the same folder as Mu.amxd ? These are required to run this version of Mu. The /Max Audio Effects/ Folder inside your live library is where Mu.amxd should be.

Works fine for me. Tried on several systems. Mac OSX Lion, Win 7 etc. Live 8/9 Max 5.1.9 +

Is there any chance you can be more specific, on what is not working? Have you tried opening up the "Max Window" to see any errors, by right clicking the top bar of the live device?

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
I know a bit about Max and Lemur setup . . .
Yep 32bit Live and Max . . .
.js files copied as well .. . .

There is a problem with your Mu.path edits throwing an error -
Will look into it and report back either here or vi PM if you prefer . . .
Cheers
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

No problem to talk here.

Could you describe the error in more detail? What's it saying in the max window? What is causing you to think that its Mu.path that's the problem?

First thing I would check is that you have deleted any old versions of Mu. It could be picking up an old version of Mu.path.maxpat? - this was the fix implemented to make it work on Max 5.1.9 + . I dont see how it would work differently on our systems, they are identical, apart from the Mac OSX (which I very much doubt would cause differences).

One way of checking that youre not picking up an old version, might be to click on the "view code" part of the amxd, while it is not open in the max editor. Then click on "p devices", "Mu.deviceeditora /deviceA" , "p_devicename_to_jzlibPath" and finally "Mu.path" - this way you can see whether you are using a previous version, or the edited one. In any case, its essential to ensure that you dont have any remaining files from the old version.

I dont think its going to be possible to put the files anywhere other than your Max Cycling74 folder any more. This is because it now uses "absolutepath" in Mu.path.

On your Mac this should be:

/Applications/Max 6.1/Cycling74/

So:
/Applications/Max 6.1/Cycling74/Abstractions/
/Applications/Max 6.1/Cycling74/DeviceControllers/
/Applications/Max 6.1/Cycling74/Externals/
/Applications/Max 6.1/Cycling74/jzmls/

Also, I would recommend checking what you have in your Max search path. Maybe you have put some Mu files in a different location and linked to them in there?

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
Sorry have not had time to have a really good look yet . .
I'm pretty ok on Mu set up / Max setup and their various workings etc . . .

A few comments though:
Re: Mu.path fix implemented for it to work on 5.1.9 - Do you mean for Live 8 or Live 9 here? Mu 1.2 / Live already worked with 5.1.9 . . .
Also Mu.path already returned an absolute path even though it did not use the 'absolutepath' object . . .
Also whilst 'debugging' objects (message boxes, test code etc) are good whilst debugging, they are best removed before 'release' . . .

Re: Install locations - Those sub-folders should not be split apart like that - they should be within the Mu 1.x/Resources folder . ..
Mu (traditionally) gets an absolute path to there and then finds the folders from there . .
This is also the standard Max approach to dealing with add-on packages, otherwise things would be extremely messy if everything did this . . .

Aah - I had another quick explore of operational differences between Max 5 and Max 6, and I think I may have found a fundamental error in Max 6's response.
Will consult a few people and get back to you all later - but at this point it seems an object in 6 is not returning the same values as in 5, which is the source of the 'not loading device jzml's' problem . . .

Will worry about the other stuff later once I have gotten this part of the equation sorted

Cheers
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Actually you're right, my bad, Max 6 is where Mu.path started messing up, not 5.1.9. Yes, there was a fundamental difference between one of the objects in Mu.path that came in with Max 6, which is why I changed its operation.

You can put the files in /Resources/ if you like, it'll work either way. I just prefer to have them split up, easier to access when I'm making changes.

I've tested on several systems Win/Mac different versions of Live/Max, friends systems etc. and it works just fine, as long as the set up is correct.

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Ive contacted Liine support by email. but they're giving me no reply. Therefore, unfortunately, it appears I am not permitted to give the files to the community, upload to the user library etc.

It would take too long to explain how to create the "chains access" and "auto device select" functionality (took around 1 month to build and uses the new Javascript Liveapi). However, since Max is an open system for editing, I can suggest how you might go about fixing your own Mu to work with Max 6 and therefore Live 9. Its a very easy fix and doesnt take long (5 mins).

[*]If you have purchased the full version of Max - Open "Mu.path.maxpat" (inside your /Abstractions/Mu/ folder) to edit it.
[*]If you dont own the full version of Max, you wont be able to edit the file directly, so you will need to do it inside Live, by opening the .amxd device in edit mode. Then doubleclick on the objects "View µ code", "p devices", "Mu.deviceeditor /deviceA" , "p_devicename_to_jzlibPath" and finally "Mu.path" Also "Mu.path" will open in read-only mode (you may see the padlock in the left hand corner greyed out, or a strange pen-tool). In order to edit it you will need to go to, "File/Modify Read-Only" in your toolbar.

Delete everything inside Mu.path apart from the brown inlet box at the top and the green outlet box at the bottom. If you can't edit anything it means you are not in edit mode, so press CMD on your keyboard (CTRL if you're on windows) inside the Mu.path patcher and left click anywhere inside the patcher. Now you should be able to move objects around, edit etc.

Create the following objects: (all of these are just plain objects, except for the message box, which is noted beneath, all are connected on the left-hand outlet/inlet, unless specified otherwise)

[loadbang]
(Mu.path.maxpat) <- messagebox
[absolutepath]
[regexp (.*\\/)(.*)]
[zl ecils 1] <- 2nd outlet from above regexp, goes into 1st inlet of zl ecils
[tosymbol]
[regexp (.*)(Abstractions/)]
[zl slice] <- 2nd outlet from above regexp, goes into 1st inlet of zl slice

Finally connect left output of zl slice, to a patcher "outlet", this looks like a green square object with an O inside it.

Go to "File/Save", to Save the Mu.path patcher.

Now your Mu should work and load the devices properly.

If it's not working, go to your Mu.amxd, DONT open it in max edit mode. Instead, doubleclick on the interface, the objects "View µ code", "p devices", "Mu.deviceeditor /deviceA" , "p_devicename_to_jzlibPath" and finally "Mu.path" to check whether it is loading the changes you have made correctly (sometimes there are weird problems where max stores the old patcher, instead of using the new one you edited). If it is still using the old patcher, try to make the changes again, saving the Mu.path patcher, while you're inside it. It's important to save the Mu.path itself (and not the Mu.amxd) because this is a standalone patcher file that gets included within the parent amxd. The way I sometimes resolve these problems is to save the Mu.path patcher and then make a slight change in Mu.amxd (like moving an object one pixel to the left) and saving the Mu.amxd, basically saving both the Mu.path and the Mu.amxd

If it's still not working, you could connect the uppermost inlet (the brown square box with an "i" in it), to the left hand inlet of the messagebox, containing "Mu.path.maxpat" . This will ensure a bang message is sent to the messagebox, thereby outputting the relevant path, when Mu needs it. Mine works just fine without this.

The previous way of getting the path used the following objects and caused Mu not to work after Max v6 and therefore Live 9 (because it requires Max 6). I suspect that the "t path" object was the culprit here, going into "thispatcher".

For your reference, here is the previous way Mu.path.maxpat used:

[inlet] [loadbang] <- both connected to "t path" object beneath.
[t path]
[thispatcher]
[tosymbol] <- connected to right outlet of above this patcher
[regexp (.*)(Abstractions/)]
[zl slice 1] <- connected to 2nd outlet of above regexp
[outlet]

Anyway, good luck with it. Sorry, I can't share the other changes. I'm loving Mu. Ive been using this for weeks now and my workflow when making music has been greatly improved by this wonderful toy

Happy music making!

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
The best way to do it is with it a single Mu folder, with every thing under that - that is 'standard practice' for easy install / versioning/ maintenance etc
Also it is how most other substantial packages do it - it helps to avoid potential namespace collisions etc . .

It is also how the original was setup and how the scripting /patching etc is structured -
Then all you need is one absolute path, and subfolders are referenced to it . .

I think the best thing to do with this project would be for you to post your work to this thread so every one can get involved . .
There are a few people who's work is already included in what you have produced who would likely contribute to it further . .
I had a bit of a chat with some of the Liine people about it all, though no absolute decisions were made . .

So please just post it here and I will look at making the thread 'sticky' and we can all work towards a final version . . . .

Cheers
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
As I said before I do know a bit about Max - have been using it off and on for about 15 years or so , since about V3 on an old LCIII back in about 1998 . . .
I have the full version of Max/M4L obviously and my complete install is probably pushing 4 gigs with all the additional extra content . . ..
For most of the past year I was helping handle email support, if you had sent it in earlier in the year it would have come to me . .
I also updated the Lemur manual for them and wrote the InApp Editor Guide etc in addition to being a Forum moderator . . ..
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi Macizza,

Sorry, the last post wasnt aimed at you. Ive been contacted by various people on PM and different sites, so im directing them towards the last post.

I'm not going to be able to upload the files, until I get permission from Liine.

Cheers

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
I have worked for them and am still 'working with' them, 2 months ago you would have sent it to me
As I said I have discussed it with them briefly and basically it is fine to post it here as I have said . . .
So you could basically accept that as permission and I don't believe it would be a problem.
If it is (which it won't be) then it will be on my head . . . .
You can certainly post just individual replacement bits rather than the whole lot if you want . . .

Cheers
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi, a thosand thankyous for the instructions xmonsta worked perfectly.
Second time I tried it only took 15 mins all the device windows and Mu
are working great thankyou For your help much appreciated I look forward to
your updated version and any new releases hope you get permission to
Get it up soon .
Thankyou
RA

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Is this still dead in the water? Or has work moved on to another location?

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hi
For revised Mu path patch see this thread http://forum.liine.net/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=3043
Will post a patch for 'auto-follow device' soon . . .
MM

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

I had a chat to liine about it over email and while they didnt give permission they did mention they intend to GPL Mu, they also didnt give me any indication that It's not allowed to be uploaded here. So I shall upload Mu here first. Unfortunately, the forum wont let me upload a file this large, so I have reinstated the download

here - http://www.xmonsta.com/downloads/Audio-Software-Downloads/Mu-Lemur-1.3-Updated-for-Live-8--and--9/Mu-Lemur-for-Live-8--and--9/

Here is a small changelog:

- Fixed a glaring error within the patch, that stopped tracks/devices from being loaded when they not visible (ie inside groups). Now it works real nice.
- Removed templates that require cc creditation. Hopefully we can work towards a solution with the respective template owners, to include all Mu templates within the download. It would be nice to not to have to download templates individually and for Mu to just work out of the box, with ableton stock devices. Perhaps a good way to get around the permissions issue, would be to include the credits in the actual templates. This way the user who created the template will always get credited, no matter which device their template is included in.
- Changed the version name, so it only refers to Mu as Adapted.
- Cleaned up Mu.path

It would be great to get feedback, so if people can beta test it, it is all working before it goes into the user library.

I agree that it would be good to get the Mu.path and auto-select devices patched separately, so people can have that functionality, without being able to access chains.

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hey xmonsta - can you process my registration so I can download Mu for Live 9 please?

Thanks,
Jon

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Sure no problem. The activation link might have got caught in ur spam filter. I activated from my end tho so no need to click it now. Cheers

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Works great. I think the auto load of top control lags due to a blank message box being used for throughput in the patch. I've read this causes spikes in max, banging a blank message to a large patch. I tried a couple things but not much improvement. I added some things, like a nav mode that allows project navigation via clip grid, works great other than ableton max lag, no good for live but great at home. Thx for the upload, cheers. Hopefully Ableton works out their gui, otherwise I might move to Bitwig. Blessings.

Subject: Re: Mu updated for Live 9, access chains, auto device select

Hey jamesway,

Thanks for trying it out. In terms of the speed of loading device templates. I think this has to do with the fact that there is a "qlim 2000" object in the Mu.deviceeditora.maxpat and Mu.deviceeditor.maxpat . This will slow the loading down to 2 seconds for each template. I implemented this because there were some problems with lemur app crashing on windows. However, it seems unnecessary on mac and even windows now. Maybe remove it and you'll find it quite zippy.