Troubleshooting
Editor and Daemon windows still bugged - WIN 8
Started by whatisvalis on .
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The editor and Daemon windows are still not working in Win 8. The windows are lock to the top, you can not drag them down, and the editor still opens as a thin line (see screen)
I have done a complete uninstall, clean and re-install. Same issue.
Windows 8 64 bit (clean/new install)
Lemur 4.01
Capture.JPG
I have done a complete uninstall, clean and re-install. Same issue.
Windows 8 64 bit (clean/new install)
Lemur 4.01
Capture.JPG
Have you tried this?
http://winsplit-revolution.com/
Posted this several times now, would be interested to hear if it works on Win 8. It's a very useful util, beyond just fixing the windowing of the Liine app(s).
http://winsplit-revolution.com/
Posted this several times now, would be interested to hear if it works on Win 8. It's a very useful util, beyond just fixing the windowing of the Liine app(s).
Thanks for the recommendation, i would rather the Editor just work though. that software does look useful though, might check it out
Hi All
First I must admit that I have not touched Win8, or Win7 really , I am a Mac user . . .
Looking through the net I see various posts claiming that Win8 will run any apps that run on Win7, though that is contradicted elsewhere and with the Editor it seems wrong . . .
I also see posts regarding having to develop completely separate UI's for Win8 compared to Win7, which seems to contradict the previous statements and a bit of a bugger . . .
Putting these too crossed-facts together leaves me unsure as to where the problems really lies - with the Liine code or how Win8 is dealing with it on different systems . . .
I was not directly involved in the Win code development so am not sure whether there is one UI that should work on both or whether two UI's were needed
I do know that the apps apparently ran fine on the test machines otherwise it would not have been released if this error was standard behaviour
I would certainly like to discover the reason behind Win8 causing these problems and see this issue resolved
I would also be interested in seeing whether it is newer or older PC systems causing problems - Win8 does not run well on some older Win7 hardware apparently
If PC users can provide full details of there working or non-working setups it may assist in nailing this problem . ..
Cheers
MM
First I must admit that I have not touched Win8, or Win7 really , I am a Mac user . . .
Looking through the net I see various posts claiming that Win8 will run any apps that run on Win7, though that is contradicted elsewhere and with the Editor it seems wrong . . .
I also see posts regarding having to develop completely separate UI's for Win8 compared to Win7, which seems to contradict the previous statements and a bit of a bugger . . .
Putting these too crossed-facts together leaves me unsure as to where the problems really lies - with the Liine code or how Win8 is dealing with it on different systems . . .
I was not directly involved in the Win code development so am not sure whether there is one UI that should work on both or whether two UI's were needed
I do know that the apps apparently ran fine on the test machines otherwise it would not have been released if this error was standard behaviour
I would certainly like to discover the reason behind Win8 causing these problems and see this issue resolved
I would also be interested in seeing whether it is newer or older PC systems causing problems - Win8 does not run well on some older Win7 hardware apparently
If PC users can provide full details of there working or non-working setups it may assist in nailing this problem . ..
Cheers
MM
I think the problem lies with whatever GUI Toolkit Liine use for x-plat development of the Editor and Daemon.
To say the problem lies with Win 8 (or Win 7) and trying to chase down system configs ad nauseum is just wrong-headed. It's not as if the Editor or Daemon are exemplars of well-behaved (GUI) code on *any* version of Windows IME. So I'd start there.
In the meantime, maybe someone running Win 8 can test the linked app and confirm whether or not it resizes and positions the Editor / Daemon windows just like it does on Win 7. Because right now, that's probably the best and quickest solution at hand. (There are other apps that handle window size / position, in different ways - this one fits best with my specific mix of accelerator bits n' bobs).
To say the problem lies with Win 8 (or Win 7) and trying to chase down system configs ad nauseum is just wrong-headed. It's not as if the Editor or Daemon are exemplars of well-behaved (GUI) code on *any* version of Windows IME. So I'd start there.
In the meantime, maybe someone running Win 8 can test the linked app and confirm whether or not it resizes and positions the Editor / Daemon windows just like it does on Win 7. Because right now, that's probably the best and quickest solution at hand. (There are other apps that handle window size / position, in different ways - this one fits best with my specific mix of accelerator bits n' bobs).
Just trying to make sense of the various reports . .
I could see the GUI Toolkit having an effect on what is drawn within the window - but surely the system should be able to place the actual window onscreen properly . . .
If it shows up in Win7 (it does) - and if Win7 apps do run on Win8 (as claimed) - then surely it should show on Win8 or else Win8 is causing issues?? Or Win7 apps DO NOT just run on Win 8 . .
Obviously there are differences between 7 & 8 that are causing problems as evidenced by numerous other reports of problematic apps on Win8, not just Lemur . .
And then to put hardware compatibility issues (as mentioned) on top of that, adds to the confusion - so it may be the hardware/OS setup that is at fault . . .
Also Windows computer hardware (in general), due to many many factors, are certainly not as stable and 'compatible/equivalent' as each other, compared to Mac systems . . .
In 'in-house' testing during development of the Editor windows worked properly on test machines - it would not have been developed/released if the window did not show
Anyway the whole Win8 release seems quite a debacle to me - and also seems to be for many users and other developers - Only time will tell in the end . . .
Cheers
MM
I could see the GUI Toolkit having an effect on what is drawn within the window - but surely the system should be able to place the actual window onscreen properly . . .
If it shows up in Win7 (it does) - and if Win7 apps do run on Win8 (as claimed) - then surely it should show on Win8 or else Win8 is causing issues?? Or Win7 apps DO NOT just run on Win 8 . .
Obviously there are differences between 7 & 8 that are causing problems as evidenced by numerous other reports of problematic apps on Win8, not just Lemur . .
And then to put hardware compatibility issues (as mentioned) on top of that, adds to the confusion - so it may be the hardware/OS setup that is at fault . . .
Also Windows computer hardware (in general), due to many many factors, are certainly not as stable and 'compatible/equivalent' as each other, compared to Mac systems . . .
In 'in-house' testing during development of the Editor windows worked properly on test machines - it would not have been developed/released if the window did not show
Anyway the whole Win8 release seems quite a debacle to me - and also seems to be for many users and other developers - Only time will tell in the end . . .
Cheers
MM
I have a new machine, a z77 board with an i5 ivy processor. Win 7 ran fine, as did the Editor GUI ( although the editor would crash every time you closed it)
* Also the only app that hasn't worked correctly in W8 is Lemur. W8 has been flawless otherwise, great OS
* Also the only app that hasn't worked correctly in W8 is Lemur. W8 has been flawless otherwise, great OS
Thanks
So the same version of Editor that ran on W7 does not open properly on W8?
Anyone with W7/W8 Multi-Boot machines able to do further tests?
I have seen MS claims that W7 apps will run fine on W8 - ??
Anyone know different? Have seen reports that this is not true as well . . .
I have 10.6 - 10.8 on my Mac and test across all of them . . .
So the same version of Editor that ran on W7 does not open properly on W8?
Anyone with W7/W8 Multi-Boot machines able to do further tests?
I have seen MS claims that W7 apps will run fine on W8 - ??
Anyone know different? Have seen reports that this is not true as well . . .
I have 10.6 - 10.8 on my Mac and test across all of them . . .
Winsplit just seems to issue HWND stuff to the focussed window afaicg. I was actually surprised it worked as expected for me in sizing the Editor.
There's a caveat to this sizing and positioning however, and that is that it's really only effective for running the Editor at full size (in my case 1720*1080 minus whatever the Win 7 Taskbar takes up, yer basic maximised window IOW). I should also stress that on Win 7, I don't have a problem with opening or resizing etc.
I do have the occasional glitch with the colourpicker, the app window *really* doesn't like being painted offscreen (much, at all) . . . and it doesn't repaint so well when you drag panels. So in fact the gui toolkit, whatever it is ain't great inside the window too, thanks for bringing it up (:P
) - and it never was. Mostly cosmetic, and it does its primary job - but you know. It's 'orrible. Ugly too.
I'd venture to say the Win 8 launch is going rather better than the Lemur 4 has. But then, 8 is *easily* twice as bettar than 4 . . . so you were always on a loser there.
There's a caveat to this sizing and positioning however, and that is that it's really only effective for running the Editor at full size (in my case 1720*1080 minus whatever the Win 7 Taskbar takes up, yer basic maximised window IOW). I should also stress that on Win 7, I don't have a problem with opening or resizing etc.
I do have the occasional glitch with the colourpicker, the app window *really* doesn't like being painted offscreen (much, at all) . . . and it doesn't repaint so well when you drag panels. So in fact the gui toolkit, whatever it is ain't great inside the window too, thanks for bringing it up (:P
) - and it never was. Mostly cosmetic, and it does its primary job - but you know. It's 'orrible. Ugly too.I'd venture to say the Win 8 launch is going rather better than the Lemur 4 has. But then, 8 is *easily* twice as bettar than 4 . . . so you were always on a loser there.
Lemur Editor is buggy under Windows 8 since the beginning, i have report it to Liine support since the RC release and propose myself as beta tester. I have send mails (without answer from you, probably to busy with the lemur 4 development) when the 3.2.x was release.
But i don't thing this is a Microsoft problem, for me this a very long story that begin with the Jazzmutant editor release. If you look at the editor you can see clearly that it design is original, it don't follow the MS rules in many aspect.
I went from W7 to W8 and none of my application failed (Live, Reaper, all NI stuff, ITunes, all kind of plug-ins ...) only Lemur editor begin to be "unusable".
I think that the Lemur editor and Daemon must be rewrite from scratch to follow the MS rules, we can speak a long time about the W8 design tactile orientation, but i'm sure MS will not go backward (and overall in audio domain W8 is a real improvement).
I understand that the majority of Lemur users are on Mac or Pc with W7 os, but you must understand that some users goes under W8 for some reasons and are disappointed by the Lemur Editor situation.
But i don't thing this is a Microsoft problem, for me this a very long story that begin with the Jazzmutant editor release. If you look at the editor you can see clearly that it design is original, it don't follow the MS rules in many aspect.
I went from W7 to W8 and none of my application failed (Live, Reaper, all NI stuff, ITunes, all kind of plug-ins ...) only Lemur editor begin to be "unusable".
I think that the Lemur editor and Daemon must be rewrite from scratch to follow the MS rules, we can speak a long time about the W8 design tactile orientation, but i'm sure MS will not go backward (and overall in audio domain W8 is a real improvement).
I understand that the majority of Lemur users are on Mac or Pc with W7 os, but you must understand that some users goes under W8 for some reasons and are disappointed by the Lemur Editor situation.
The whole Metro / touchscreen / Modern UI in Win 8 is a complete red herring here in any case, as the Desktop UI is essentially intact (and largely unchanged from OS provided windowing I would imagine - if one were letting the OS handle this).
I don't even think it should be necessary to go native, there's a fsckton of x-plat apps written using several gui toolkits that manage this most basic of tasks. I can't avoid thinking this is the legacy stuff rearing its ugly head again (and still).
Personally, I'm anticipating the under-the-hood improvments to scheduling, DPC and interupt handling (in Windows 8) to be quite a boon for audio work, I'm planning on migrating to 64bit on Win 8. Can't see the whole mainstream touchscreen thing shaking out until Win 9 . . . although I wish MS had extended the touchsceen abilities to desktop apps so something like Lemur combined with Emulator were closer to reality. And no more poxy iPads (or iTunes).
I don't even think it should be necessary to go native, there's a fsckton of x-plat apps written using several gui toolkits that manage this most basic of tasks. I can't avoid thinking this is the legacy stuff rearing its ugly head again (and still).
Personally, I'm anticipating the under-the-hood improvments to scheduling, DPC and interupt handling (in Windows 8) to be quite a boon for audio work, I'm planning on migrating to 64bit on Win 8. Can't see the whole mainstream touchscreen thing shaking out until Win 9 . . . although I wish MS had extended the touchsceen abilities to desktop apps so something like Lemur combined with Emulator were closer to reality. And no more poxy iPads (or iTunes).
Hi All
So I got hold of Parrallels and the Win8 preview etc etc etc
And heres my take on it all . . .
Yes the apps open as a thin line at the top of screen . . .
Hover the mouse over the right hand end until it becomes arrows and drag to resize . . .
It did not drag to full size but clicking '+' (top left window bar) maximises it and makes it usable . . .
Same deal with Daemon as with Editor - maximise to use as full window . . .
Both apps appear fully usable . . .
Does this same procedure give same results on Win8 on a PC?
Cheers
MM
So I got hold of Parrallels and the Win8 preview etc etc etc
And heres my take on it all . . .
Yes the apps open as a thin line at the top of screen . . .
Hover the mouse over the right hand end until it becomes arrows and drag to resize . . .
It did not drag to full size but clicking '+' (top left window bar) maximises it and makes it usable . . .
Same deal with Daemon as with Editor - maximise to use as full window . . .
Both apps appear fully usable . . .
Does this same procedure give same results on Win8 on a PC?
Cheers
MM
Yes exactly the same on PC.
It doesn't stop me to work, but you have to resize all the panels every time and there is an annoying black column in the right of the screen when in fullscreen.
Hope it will be fix soon.
It doesn't stop me to work, but you have to resize all the panels every time and there is an annoying black column in the right of the screen when in fullscreen.
Hope it will be fix soon.